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 Post subject: Re: FRANK ZAPPA AND JAZZ
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2002 9:35 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 11, 2002 7:45 pm
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Location: St-Hyacinthe, Québec, Canada
No matter what the Master said. His Jazz influenced pieces are amongst the most interrresting ones in his catalog. For my part, I wish he had done more.

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 Post subject: Re: FRANK ZAPPA AND JAZZ
PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2002 7:15 am 
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Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2002 2:47 am
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Location: Netherlands
Incidentally, I'm working on transcribing a couple of Zappa songs myself, and I was working on Big Swifty, but something is really confusing me:<br><br>[quote author=Mattie_Told_Hattie link=board=legends&num=1033427931&start=15#22 date=10/16/02 at 00:02:20]<br>1 bar of 4/4<br>1 bar of 5/8<br>1 bar of 6/8<br>[/quote]<br><br>I also transcribed this part as one bar of 4/4, one bar of 5/8 and one bar of 6/8 (123 123 123 123 | 12 123 | 123 123), but when I program it into a sequencer, the second and third bars come out sounding way too slow compared to the first bar. So, this transcription only works when you change the tempo in the last two bars. Can't imagine that Zappa wrote it down like that. But I haven't found a suitable alternative yet..<br><br>I wrote the beginning bars down like this:<br><br>| 7/8   | 7/8 | 3/4 | 3/4 | (repeat 4x)<br>| 7/8   | 7/8 | 3/4 | 3/4 | (repeat 2x)<br>| 5/8   | 5/8 | 5/8 | 3/4 | 3/4| 3/4| 3/4| 3/4 | 3/4 | (repeat 2x)<br>| 4/4   | 4/4 | (repeat 2x)<br>(insert mystery part here)<br><br>Since my transcription of the third line also differs from both of you, here's how I have it written down in notes:<br><br>Image<br><br>Please point out any mistakes I might have made, it's a good learning experience. <br>

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 Post subject: Re: FRANK ZAPPA AND JAZZ
PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2002 8:05 am 
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Location: Netherlands
Thanks for the tips, MTH. I'll see if I can change the duration of an eight note in the second and third bar to the duration of 1/3 of a triplet. <br><br>Today, I did some work on transcribing the marimba & synth unison intro on the Stage #2 version of RDNZL, it's turning out really nice. Some tough chromatic parts to hear, though.. I wonder how long it took to memorize parts like that. :)

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 Post subject: re: fz & jazz
PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2003 7:00 pm 
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studebaker wrote:
...Today, I did some work on transcribing the marimba & synth unison intro on the Stage #2 version of RDNZL,...
<

yo' mr stude.....when you get it figued out, can you post rdnzl in *SPAM* ¿

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Last edited by slime.oofytv.set on Fri Jul 21, 2006 3:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: re: fz & jazz
PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2003 9:15 pm 
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son_of_green_genes wrote:
ARE JAZZ MUSIC A BIGGEST ZAPPA INFLUENCE TO COMPOSITIONS WITH DIALOGUES (FREE JAZZ AND AVANT GARDE SCHOOLS/ARCHIE SHEPP/SUN RA/ETC...)OR IT´S A SIMPLY COINCIDENCE?


zappalog page 122/musicians credits lists: archie shepp (special guest)...anyone knows where/when this happened or what was performed/recorded?  

only evidence i could find was this ----> archie shepp tenor saxophone 10/28/84 amherst

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Last edited by slime.oofytv.set on Fri Jul 21, 2006 3:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: FRANK ZAPPA AND JAZZ
PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2003 12:32 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 02, 2002 1:55 pm
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There´s one performance preserved on YCDTOSA vol.4 , where Shepp is playing a solo on Let´s Move To Cleveland. I don´t know if they performed more tunes together or if it was just a one shot deal..(hehe)..The tape traders here probably know more.

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 Post subject: Re: FRANK ZAPPA AND JAZZ
PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2003 1:01 pm 
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[quote author=palokas link=board=legends;num=1033427931;start=45#46 date=05/11/03 at 03:32:34]There´s one performance preserved on YCDTOSA vol.4 , where Shepp is playing a solo on Let´s Move To Cleveland. I don´t know if they performed more tunes together or if it was just a one shot deal..(hehe)..The tape traders here probably know more.[/quote] I love Shepp... I'd really like to know if there are more Zappa/Shepp recodings... Anyone knows?<br>

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 Post subject: Re: FRANK ZAPPA AND JAZZ
PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2003 2:46 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2002 3:49 pm
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Location: The White Zone
One of you is talking about TEMPOS (how many beats per minute) and the other is talking about TIME SIGNATURES (how many quarter, eighth, sixteenth, etc . . . notes per measure).  You are both correct in a sense: as evinced by Big Swifty, FZ did use VARIOUS time signatures, even within the same piece.  However, I'm not sure who started what, but the TEMPO person is correct as to what FZ said about flexable time and polyrhythyms.   <br><br>When FZ refers to FLEXIBLE TIME in the RFZB HE is talking about TEMPOS.  In FZ's view, jazz drummers speed up and slow down the 4/4 (or whatever) TIME SIGNATURE which screws up the polyrhythyms because THEY ARE POLYRYHTHYMIC ONLY when superimposed against STEADY METRONOMIC (not speeding up or slowing down) TEMPOS.  If you play 5 1/16 notes evenly over a bar of 5/16, it IS NOT a polyryhthym (tho it IS in an ODD time signature . . . 3 is an ODD number, but not ODDBALL ODD); if you play 5 1/16 notes evenly over one quarter note, IT IS a polyrhythym because you can only "fit" FOUR "real" 1/16 notes evenly over a quarter note.  If the quarter notes SLOW DOWN to permit a player to SQUEEZE IN those 5 1/16 notes, the TEMPO has become FLEXIBLE, and you have arrived at the very rubato in which FZ didn't want to wallow.  Websters Dictionary: "RUBATO: a FLUCTUATION of TEMPO within a musical phrase often AGAINST a rhythymically STEADY accompaniment."<br><br>However, this argument has informed us of the TIME SIGNATURES in Big Swifty for which we should be thankful.<br><br>VCF

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