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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 7:57 am 
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Yup, we're all gonna die someday. No doubt about that!<br><br>Sometimes we can pick our poison, sometimes it is thrust upon us. <br><br>If I can choose, make mine something other than cigarette smoke.<br><br>Ya'all can choose whatever you prefer.

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 1:08 pm 
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well ive been at it for 10 years and i have to say i wish i never started , quittin of course is a different issue but what i always wonderd was this - <br><br>if i smoke a regular ammount of tobacco per day its relativly easy for researchers to guage the potential health effects form me and other smokers and formulate those stats into some kind of meaningful info regarding health risks - how you do that with passive smoking where there are so many vairyable factors relating to the ammount of smoke inhaled ? <br>in fact much research that alleges to demonstrate long term health risks of so called passive somking is generally regarded as being " JUNK SCIENCE " . that isnt to dispute that smoke makes yer eyes water and stuff or that lawers can make a case out of thin air - its just a general observation.<br><br>i worked with this guy once who hated any kind of smoke near him at all - even in the bar we had to be careful not to upset him , which was fine except for the fact he blamed his asthma on our smoking - of course he had smoked for 20 years but that fact didnt strike him as a likely cause of his asthma - for some its always somebody elses fault.<br><br>mungo

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 5:56 pm 
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Location: Windsor,Ontario Canada
I have been smoking for 20 years and if i know someone who has a problem with smokers i don't smoke around that person,but if i meet someone and they have a problem with me smoking i put the dam thing out.


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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2003 12:18 pm 
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[quote author=jimmie d link=board=general;num=1046955851;start=30#32 date=04/02/03 at 05:50:11][center][font=century gothic]Smoking ban cuts risk of heart attack by half: study[/font][/center][/quote]<br>Can't wait to read what Mungo has to say about this one !  ;D

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2003 12:21 pm 
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and the debate rages on...<br><br>but nothing will be changed

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 6:12 am 
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But data can be (and is) manipulated so easily to tell whichever side of the story one wants to favor.:P<br><br>And competing interests will always exist.<br><br>So, who do you believe? Who do you wanna believe?<br><br>Questions, questions, questions...flooding the mind of the concerned young person of today............

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 11:53 am 
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Sadly funny how the evidences don't seem to stick !<br><br>Until my own arm is cut off, I won't believe it hurts !<br><br>Sad, sad, sad...

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 12:31 pm 
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[quote author=Arkay link=board=general;num=1046955851;start=30#37 date=04/03/03 at 08:37:43]<br>.... Studying the guessing games of risk or chance is not science and should never lead to a statement such as "A causes B".[/quote]<br><br>Everyone repeat after me, "Correlation does not imply causation".<br><br>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++<br><br>However, I do believe smoking increases risk of early onset of some cancers and heart/lung diseases. <br>

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 5:34 pm 
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[quote author=Arkay link=board=general;num=1046955851;start=30#39 date=04/03/03 at 14:05:07]<br>Yer not knocking proof are ya?  [/quote]<br>No, you're right. I've no numbers to give. Just the fruit of some observations ! Isn't that the way to start discoveries, observing ? Just plain observations ! <br>That's why I talked about evidences. If someone jump the bridge and die, why would I need numbers to figure out his death ? I saw it, right ? Same with smoke.   8)

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2003 8:14 am 
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[quote author=jimmie d link=board=general;num=1046955851;start=30#42 date=04/04/03 at 05:06:20][center]<br>Image[/center][/quote]<br><br>Florida once again proving itself to be a bastion of ignorance.<br>

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2003 2:45 pm 
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Location: Bay Area, CA
I'm a non-smoker. Both of my parents smoked heavily. A pack or two packs per day, each. $$$$$$$$ (I'm mentioning this as a foreward, meaning that i'm not a huge anti-smoker person. I grew up with it around me all the time, it bugged me, but I'm not some retarded zealot whom you will find standing in a street blocking traffic anytime soon)<br><br>Anyways, that was when I lived in the south. I live in california now, where smoking isn't allowed indoors at all. Period.<br><br>When friends visit me that is the first thing they comment on. The fact that we can go shoot pool, and come out smelling the same as we did when we came in. Go to bars and drink. Be able to see on the way home. No burn holes in my clothing.<br><br>Hell, you can even wear your clothes to sleep if you choose to. It's really an amazing thing. The people bitching about the NYC ban will still be bitching years from now. People are too stubborn in general. <br><br>Some things will never change.<br><br>
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Until my own arm is cut off, I won't believe it hurts !
<br><br>How true that is.


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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2003 1:56 pm 
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no i didnt read the link im fraid as there is no point - are we really bent on somekind of statistical showdown in this place - are any of us qualified in any way to have a debate on epidimiology / stat mathematics - nahh ! whats the point ?<br><br>ive already been suckerd into a futile serise of exchanges by those who dont know their iraqs from irans , their tyrants from tossers, once this year - let the dumb remain dumb and revel in their dumbness - im not in the business of even entertaining another round of pig shit debate this year . so be it.<br><br>all i know is that researchers are all paid by someone to  produce research the conclusion of which has already been decided - by whoever pays en , according to their agenda - there are NO independant scientists anymore - they are all beholden to somebody.<br><br>churchill said - there are lies , damm lies and statistics - i get his point. <br><br>for more info on this subject of quackery check out www.numberwatch.co.uk and the links contained within - its food for thought.<br><br>mungo<br>

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2003 5:27 am 
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[quote author=Thing-Fish24 link=board=general;num=1046955851;start=45#45 date=04/04/03 at 19:04:40]Dosen't Anybody See That The Ban On Smoking In New York public places is a violation of the a document called "THE CONSTITUTION"?   >:( This Is Bullshit!  >:([/quote]<br><br>It may or may not be bullshit, but it certainly does not violate the Constitution.

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2003 6:23 am 
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I love to Smoke, and really don't care if other people like it or not. Some people offend my nose with their perfumes, Beer breath, liquor Breath, Pot Breath. It dont bother me so I guess I really dont care if it bothers someone else. But if it does they can always leave, Most of the time the perfume/colonge stinch of these beings is affecting me more than my smoking is affecting them.

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2003 7:11 am 
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[quote author=jimmie d link=board=general;num=1046955851;start=45#51 date=04/07/03 at 09:57:18]<br>I think that you've presented a stupid and inconsiderate argument, Mr. Nez. When a single person lights up in a club, most often, nearly the entire club is contaminated with smoke. If someone has on perfume or has halitosis or some other body odor, it's not likely to contaminate the entire area of the club. Sounds like you're the kind of guy who doesn't mind standing at the front of the stage exhaling smoke for the performers and patrons to inhale without the benefit of your filter, should you use one.<br><br>"When we entered Britain's Cleanest City competition last year the biggest criticism was about the quantity of cigarette-related litter." <br>-- official in Coventry, England [Coventry Evening Telegraph]<br><br>"Each year more than 1 billion pieces of litter will accumulate on Texas highways. Of those, 13 percent are cigarette butts. That means 130 million butts will be tossed out in Texas alone this year."<br>--Texas Department of Transportation <br><br>Have you noticed the clusters of cigarette butts on our streets, sidewalks, beaches, playgrounds and other public places? There is a very good chance that those cigarettes were sold at Wal-Mart stores. There is also a very good chance that those butts wouldn't have been littered if Wal-Mart cared enough to take even small steps in educating its millions of smoking customers about the environmental impact of cigarette litter, or if it even bothered to sell pocket ashtrays in its stores. <br><br>What Wal-Mart apparently wants to keep quiet is that tens of billions of cigarettes are littered across the United States every year. The filters are made of cellulose acetate tow, not cotton, and can take over ten years to decompose. The filters of littered cigarette butts release harmful chemicals into the environment and into our water supply. Littered cigarettes are also a leading cause of wildfires. And, of course, littered cigarette butts make our communities look filthy![/quote]<br><br><br>That all makes very good sense JD. I could really care less what wal-mart should or should not do though, Sorry. Actually I notice more paper, be it news paper or anykind littering the streets. As for me I don't throw butts on the ground, so your statement really dont apply to me. I also seem to notice more cans, beer what ever on the roads and lawns of our abodes, usually where passer bys feel free to fling their trash out.<br>As far as one person lighting up in a club and ruining the hole thing for everyone, well I just dont agree with that, and yes I think perfumes can do the same thing, as far as ruining the sent of what you think should be a well scented bar. If it ruins it for ya' do what I do Leave. Or if you wish confront the person. as far as my argument being stupid and inconsiderate, well I'm just telling the truth, my opinion what have ya', So I really don't intend to hammer back at ya' except maybe to say you should look at it in a more reality point of view. SOME LIKE IT & SOME DONT.<br><br>Forgive me for any inconsiderations toward your feelings I was speaking my mind.

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 Post subject: Re: NO SMOKING
PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2003 7:50 am 
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[quote author=jimmie d link=board=general;num=1046955851;start=45#53 date=04/07/03 at 10:38:56]<br><br>I expected the "more cans" argument from ya...you know it's not true nor does it justify the littering of butts.<br><br>According to your code of expected behavior, the five non-smoking members of Project/Object are to exit the club in order to avoid inhaling your exhaled smoke...eh?  ...not that you care.[/quote]<br><br>Come on Man, I did'nt mean to touch a nerve. The can thing is not an argument or a way to justify littering Butts and no I dont know it isn't true and frankly I dont think you do either. I dont litter butts or cans or paper. I play in bars. Smoke does'nt bother me. Yes I feel bad for your band in that they have allergic reactions to ciggarette smoke. Maybe they should think more under age venues where smoking is prohibited with People there who can make sure that no one is smoking. I really don't care because PROJECT OBJECT was not my point. hey man that's part of playing. So I guess when you say I don't care in that respect your right. <br><br>I just said I loved to smoke and I do. You dont. and it seems you have some sort of problem with ones who do. My advice would be to get over it man. Play smokeless venues. Then you will have nothing to complain about. <br>

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