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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 1:42 am 
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Disco Boy wrote:
Caputh wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
ONE. MORE. TIME. FOR. THE. WORLD.:

NO EVIDENCE PROVING... OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE.


What part of this do you NOT understand, morons?! :roll:


Because that's what you and Sean Hannity say and not what the Mueller report says.


No, that's what the report says. You might want to try reading it sometime...

How is it possible for you (or anyone) to be this fucking stupid?! :shock:



Some examples for evidence from the Mueller report, then...

Firing of James Comey
“Firing Comey would qualify as an obstructive act if it had the natural and probable effect of interfering with or impeding the investigation.” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 74)
Substantial evidence” indicates that Trump fired Comey because of “Comey’s unwillingness to publicly state that the President was not personally under investigation.” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 75)
"[E]vidence … indicates that the President wanted to protect himself from an investigation into his campaign.” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 75.)

Efforts to fire Mueller
This “would qualify as an obstructive act” if the firing “would naturally obstruct the investigation and any grand jury proceedings that might flow from the inquiry.” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 87.)
Substantial evidence indicates that the President’s attempts to remove the Special Counsel were linked to the Special Counsel’s oversight of investigations that involved the President’s conduct[.]” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 89.)

Efforts to curtail Mueller
“[W]ould qualify as an obstructive act if it would naturally obstruct the investigation and any grand jury proceedings that might flow from the inquiry.” “Taken together, the President’s directives indicate that Sessions was being instructed to tell the Special Counsel to end the existing investigation into the President and his campaign[.]” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 97.)
Substantial evidence” that Trump “intended to prevent further investigative scrutiny of the President’s and his campaign’s conduct.” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 97.)

Efforts to have Sessions take over the investigation
"The duration of the President’s efforts … and the fact that the President repeatedly criticized Sessions in public and private for failing to tell the President that he would have to recuse is relevant to assessing whether the President’s efforts to have Sessions unrecuse could qualify as obstructive acts.” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p.111.)
There is evidence that at least one purpose of the President’s conduct toward Sessions was to have Sessions assume control over the Russia investigation and supervise it in a way that would restrict its scope.” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p.111.)

Order to McGahn to deny Trump’s order to fire Mueller
“[W]ould qualify as an obstructive act if it had the natural tendency to constrain McGahn from testifying truthfully or to undermine his credibility as a potential witness[.]” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 118.)
Substantial evidence indicates that … the President acted for the purpose of influencing McGahn’s account in order to deflect or prevent further scrutiny”. (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 120.)

Conduct toward Michael Cohen
[T]he evidence … could support an inference that the President used inducements in the form of positive messages in an effort to get Cohen not to cooperate, and then turned to attacks and intimidation to deter the provision of information or to undermine Cohen’s credibility once Cohen began to cooperate.” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 153.)
"There is evidence that could support the inference that the President intended to discourage Cohen from cooperating with the government. … The evidence could support an inference that the President was aware of [Cohen’s efforts to continue the Moscow Project past January 2016] at the time of Cohen’s false statements to Congress. … The President’s public remarks following Cohen’s guilty plea also suggest that the President may have been concerned about what Cohen told investigators about the Trump Tower Moscow project. … The President’s concern about Cohen cooperating may have been directed at the Southern District of New York investigation into other aspects of the President’s dealings with Cohen rather than the investigation of Trump Tower Moscow. There is also some evidence that the President’s concern about Cohen cooperating was based on the President’s stated belief that Cohen would provide false testimony against the President in an attempt to obtain a lesser sentence for his unrelated criminal conduct. … Finally, the President’s statements insinuating that members of Cohen’s family committed crimes after Cohen began cooperating with the government could be viewed as an effort to retaliate against Cohen and chill further testimony adverse to the President by Cohen or others.” (Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 155.)

Image
(Mueller Report, Vol. II, p. 182. Exactly the same paragraph occurs in the introduction of Volume II on p.2 and on page eight.)

In addition, in contrast to Barr's claim that Mueller didn’t indicate whether he would leave the question of Trump’s possible obstruction of justice up to Congress, Mueller quite clearly states that...
"The conclusion that Congress may apply obstruction laws to the President’s corrupt exercise of the powers of office accords with our constitutional system of checks and balances and the principle that no person is above the law." (Mueller Report, Vol II, p. eight.)

But you obviously know this all already, having read the report... :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 4:13 pm 
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SON. OF. ONE. MORE. TIME. FOR. THE. WORLD.:

THERE IS NO EVIDENCE PROVING TRUMP/RUSSIAN COLLUSION OR OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE.


What part of this do you NOT understand?! :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 4:21 pm 
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Disco Boy wrote:
What part of this do you NOT understand?! :roll:
Don't you understand we understand you don't understand? 8)

Dale Cummings
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Bill Day
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Ed Wexler
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Steve Sack
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Last edited by Mr. Nice Guy on Mon May 06, 2019 9:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 4:43 pm 
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pedro1 wrote:

If click bait sites are what you use for information and understanding then that explains a lot.

pedro1 wrote:
When governments include themselves into a capitalistic economic machine , it is no longer ' Capitalism '.
What you refer to is actually a ' mixed economy '.
It's just semantics - unless a significant proportion of the means of production is publicly owned, which, in most western countries, is not the case. Early last century, many countries accepted utilities being publicly owned, but the bastards are even unravelling that. In the western world, the vast majority of the means of production and the wealth garnered thereof, is privately owned. A true mixed economy would have a significant proportion of the means of production as public enterprise, otherwise, how could a plan be possible? Governments can introduce whatever legislation they like, but while they don't actually own, or run, the means of production and continue to allow the owners to take very little social responsibility for their appropriation of what is fundamentally a social product, it's not a real mixed economy.

Spin it how you like, fashion the vehicle how you will, but it's still capitalism under the hood.

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 11:00 pm 
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Once upon a time there was a little boy called Disco. One day he watched Hannity and didn't read the Mueller Report.
Disco Boy wrote:
SON. OF. ONE. MORE. TIME. FOR. THE. WORLD.:

THERE IS NO EVIDENCE PROVING TRUMP/RUSSIAN COLLUSION OR OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE.


What part of this do you NOT understand?! :roll:

And he and Hannity lived happily every after.

Image *

Image

* "Nexus" = a connection or link between things, persons, or events especially that is or is part of a chain of causation

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 2:24 am 
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All that patience trying to educate a guy who doesn't give a damn...
:P
All that time lost in a lost cause...
:P
Is it worth it, Caputh ?
Cause I suppose you know you'll never achieve anything with that kid, don't you ?

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 8:06 am 
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The subject of this thread could also be described as a lost cause. Yet he never fails to entertain me in some weird way. How about you?
I love lost causes. :D

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Last edited by Caputh on Mon May 06, 2019 8:19 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 8:08 am 
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!

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Last edited by Mij on Mon May 06, 2019 8:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 8:09 am 
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Caputh wrote:
I love lost causes! :D

YOU SURE DO !!!
:mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 8:28 am 
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Mij wrote:
Caputh wrote:
I love lost causes! :D

YOU SURE DO !!!
:mrgreen:


Sorry, I edited my post, while you were making yours. If both you and I find Trump unredeemably venial, mendacious, stubborn and stupid, why are we therefore both still posting on this thread? Could it be that we both have a prurient interest?

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 9:36 am 
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Caputh wrote:
Mij wrote:
Caputh wrote:
I love lost causes! :D

YOU SURE DO !!!
:mrgreen:


Sorry, I edited my post, while you were making yours. If both you and I find Trump unredeemably venial, mendacious, stubborn and stupid, why are we therefore both still posting on this thread? Could it be that we both have a prurient interest?



All I know if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and looks like a duck...it's a Russian Operative that lies and try's to investigations... :smoke:


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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 9:37 am 
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Caput wrote:
. . . why are we therefore both still posting on this thread?
You come for the cartoons. 8)

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 10:53 am 
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Well... possibly :D

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 11:00 am 
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I guess I like to read stupid peoples express themselves.
It's a valid source of Entertainment.
And there's never a shortage of stupid peoples...
:mrgreen:
OH, and for the cartoons too, OF COURSE !!!
8)

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 2:19 pm 
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What cartoons... :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: trump
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 4:21 pm 
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Caput wrote:
. . . why are we therefore both still posting on this thread?
Mr. Nice Guy wrote:
You come for the cartoons. 8)

well, yeah, I do. 8)

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 4:44 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 7:06 pm 
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Since Caputh still hasn't answered my question, I might as well ask it again...


RETURN. OF. THE. SON. OF. ONE. MORE. TIME. FOR. THE. WORLD.:

THERE IS NO EVIDENCE PROVING TRUMP/RUSSIAN COLLUSION OR OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE.


What part of this do you NOT understand?!


Also, and again, as evidenced in Barr's televised testimony, when Barr phoned Mueller to ask him about his complaint, Mueller confirmed that it had NOTHING to do with Barr's summary being incorrect, but instead had to do with Barr not including the media's coverage in his summary. That's IT. :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 8:06 pm 
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Trump's tariff threat causes stock market slide

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMk6L4eoG2Q
https://www.msnbc.com/stephanie-ruhle/watch/stocks-slide-as-trump-s-threat-of-new-penalties-scares-investors-58940997818
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/may/06/markets-tumble-after-trump-threatens-to-dramatically-increase-china-tariffs

No surprise here !
:smoke:

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 8:13 pm 
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What will happen if Trump is not elected in 2020 ?

https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/06/politics/donald-trump-2020-election/index.html
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/trump-president-2020-democrat-race-831539/

WOW ! Democracy is a dead fish in USA !
Will justice prevails ?
:P

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 10:04 pm 
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Disco Boy wrote:
Since Caputh still hasn't answered my question, I might as well ask it again...


RETURN. OF. THE. SON. OF. ONE. MORE. TIME. FOR. THE. WORLD.:

THERE IS NO EVIDENCE PROVING TRUMP/RUSSIAN COLLUSION OR OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE.


What part of this do you NOT understand?!


Also, and again, as evidenced in Barr's televised testimony, when Barr phoned Mueller to ask him about his complaint, Mueller confirmed that it had NOTHING to do with Barr's summary being incorrect, but instead had to do with Barr not including the media's coverage in his summary. That's IT. :roll:


I think it's probably the part about how a living, breathing homo sapiens, who has not had a lobotomy could believe that the above was the case after having read the Mueller Report.

Apparently, over 450 Republican and Democrat federal prosecutors now have the same difficulty. "Trump would have been charged with obstruction were he not president hundreds of former prosecutors assert."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/na ... d02c9357ab

But my misunderstanding has now turned to understanding, as I realize that like Barr, who lied about his conversation with Mueller (as proven by the letter written to Barr by Mueller on the 27th of March 2019, viz: "The summary letter the Department sent to Congress and released to the public late in the afternoon of March 24 did not fully capture the context, nature, and substance of this Office's work and conclusions." ), this person was also lying to cover his own errors. Either that, or he's had a lobotomy. Or he hasn't read the Mueller Report.

In any case, thank you for confirming my suspicions.

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 9:29 am 
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Adam Zyglis
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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 7:33 pm 
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Caputh wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
Since Caputh still hasn't answered my question, I might as well ask it again...


RETURN. OF. THE. SON. OF. ONE. MORE. TIME. FOR. THE. WORLD.:

THERE IS NO EVIDENCE PROVING TRUMP/RUSSIAN COLLUSION OR OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE.


What part of this do you NOT understand?!


Also, and again, as evidenced in Barr's televised testimony, when Barr phoned Mueller to ask him about his complaint, Mueller confirmed that it had NOTHING to do with Barr's summary being incorrect, but instead had to do with Barr not including the media's coverage in his summary. That's IT. :roll:


I think it's probably the part about how a living, breathing homo sapiens, who has not had a lobotomy could believe that the above was the case after having read the Mueller Report.

Apparently, over 450 Republican and Democrat federal prosecutors now have the same difficulty. "Trump would have been charged with obstruction were he not president hundreds of former prosecutors assert."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/na ... d02c9357ab


Those are opinions. Which, in fact, make NO sense for a couple of reasons. Firstly, if that was true, then there would've been NO point to the investigation other than to smear Trump's name. Secondly, it also makes NO sense considering Mueller recommended NO further indictments since...

RETURN. OF. THE. RETURN. OF. THE. SON. OF. ONE. MORE. TIME. FOR. THE. WORLD.:

...THERE IS NO EVIDENCE PROVING TRUMP/RUSSIAN COLLUSION OR OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE.


Caputh wrote:
But my misunderstanding has now turned to understanding, as I realize that like Barr, who lied about his conversation with Mueller (as proven by the letter written to Barr by Mueller on the 27th of March 2019, viz: "The summary letter the Department sent to Congress and released to the public late in the afternoon of March 24 did not fully capture the context, nature, and substance of this Office's work and conclusions." ), this person was also lying to cover his own errors. Either that, or he's had a lobotomy. Or he hasn't read the Mueller Report.

In any case, thank you for confirming my suspicions.


ONE. MORE. TIME. FOR. THE. WORLD.:

Also, and again, as evidenced in Barr's televised testimony, when Barr phoned Mueller to ask him about his complaint, Mueller confirmed that it had NOTHING to do with Barr's summary being incorrect, but instead had to do with Barr not including the media's coverage in his summary. That's IT.



And btw, Barr wasn't even required to release the Mueller Report. Which renders your assumption that Barr was covering up or lying to make NO sense whatsoever. :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 7:50 pm 
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Why the fine print? :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: TRUMP
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 9:36 pm 
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