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PostPosted: Sun Nov 26, 2006 5:00 pm 
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Yeah. Other than ' Mudshark' and "Do You Like My New Car?" they all have pretty nice melodies that could work well-for instance, done as sleazy big band type stuff..that would be nice. (I think I stole that idea from Polydigm)


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 26, 2006 5:39 pm 
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I suppose you're really more referring to one particular aspect of FZ' work. Several of FZ songs that have vocals can work well as instrumentals: "Strictly Genteel", "Duke of Prunes", "Mr Green Genes" and so on. Not so with "fillmore east" F&E stuff.


yes.

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Yeah. Other than ' Mudshark' and "Do You Like My New Car?" they all have pretty nice melodies that could work well-for instance, done as sleazy big band type stuff..that would be nice. (I think I stole that idea from Polydigm)


but would they compare with, for instance, peaches or dog breath? this getting far beyond what i wanted it to be, but i think i've made my point.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 26, 2006 6:25 pm 
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They could, if they were arranged properly, with some possible additions.
I have no doubt that it could work VERY well.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 26, 2006 11:56 pm 
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Get this: "Bwana Dik" is "Duodenum" is "theme from Lumpy Gravy". For that particular piece, FZ took an already existing instrumental and added groupie lyrics to it. So that's one of the pieces that have lyrics added after the fact. Much like "Holiday In Berlin", the melody had already existed before the German riot even took place.

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 1:08 pm 
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Check out archive.org for interesting stuff on Varése, Slonimsky and more. Slonimsky talks about Zappa, for example. Zappa´s testimony before Congress can be found etc.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2017 11:03 am 
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FeralCats, a sorely missed cat;

Meanwhile, 60 years ago:

Frank Zappa, to Varèse, wrote:
Mr. Edgard Varèse 188 Sullivan St. New York, New York

Dear Sir,

Perhaps you might remember me from my stupid phone call last January, if not, my name again is Frank Zappa Jr. I am 16 years old ... that might explain partly my disturbing you last winter. The reason for my letter at this time is that I am visiting relatives in Baltimore and as long as I am on the East Coast I hope I can get to see you.

It might seem strange but ever since I was 13 I have been interested in your music. The whole thing stems from the time when the keeper of this little record store sold me your album "The Complete Works of Edgard Varèse, Vol.l." The only reason I knew it existed was that an article in either LOOK or the POST mentioned it as being noisy and unmusical and only good for trying out the sound systems in high fidelity units (referring to your "IONISATIONS"). I don't know how the store I got it from ever obtained it, but, after several hearings, I became curious and bought it for $5.40, which, at the time seemed awfully high and being so young, kept me broke for three weeks. Now I wouldn't trade it for anything and I am looking around for another copy as the one I have is very worn and scratchy.

After I had struggled through Mr. Finklestein's notes on the back cover (I really did struggle too, for at the time I had had no training in music other than practice at drum rudiments) I became more and more interested in you and your music. I began to go to the library and take out books on modern composers and modern music, to learn all I could about Edgard Varèse. It got to be my best subject (your life) and I began writing my reports and term papers on you at school. At one time when my history teacher asked us to write on an American that has really done something for the U.S.A. I wrote on you and the Pan American Composers League and the New Symphony. I failed. The teacher had never heard of you and said I made the whole thing up. Silly but true. That was in my Sophomore year in high school.

Throughout my life all the talents and abilities that God has left me with have been self developed, and when the time came for Frank to learn how to read and write music, Frank taught himself that too. I picked it all up from the library.

I have been composing for two years now, utilizing a strict twelve-tone technique, producing effects that are reminiscent of Anton Webern.

During those two years I have written two short woodwind quartets and a short symphony for winds, brass and percussion.

Recently I have been earning my keep at home with my blues band, the BLACKOUTS. We have done quite well and in my association with my fellow musicians I am learning to play other instruments besides drums.

I paint in oils and watercolor and last year produced a cartoon film in school by painting color directly onto a 250 foot reel of cleared 16 mm movie film. I painted on the color in such a way that I managed to closely, but not completely, synchronize their movements to your "DENSITY 21.5" and the second "movement" of "OCTANDRE". It brought about some amazing results from the audience and my counselors in the office allowed me to make a trip I had planned to Walt Disney studios with the film.

Nothing ever came of my trip, but when I got back to school I was informed I had a chance to be skipped from the Junior year in high school to the Freshman year at the junior college which adjoined the school as an experiment.

I went to the Jaycee and studied harmony and music appreciation and history for one semester and came out of it with A's and B's.

I plan to go on and be a composer after college and I could really use the counsel of a veteran such as you. If you would allow me to visit with you for even a few hours it would be greatly appreciated.

It may sound strange but I think I have something to offer you in the way of new ideas. One is an elaboration on the principle of Ruth Seeger's contrapuntal dynamics and the other is an extension of the twelve-tone technique which I call the inversion square. It enables one to compose harmonically constructed pantonal music in logical patterns and progressions while still abandoning tonality.

Would you please reply as soon as possible because I will not be here much longer. My address here is 4803 Loch Raven Blvd., Baltimore Maryland. Phone Hopkins 77336. Thank you for your consideration. Sincerely,

Frank Zappa Jr.

Mr. Varèse then wrote:
VII 12th/57
Dear Mr. Zappa
I am sorry not to be able to grant your request. I am leaving
for Europe next week and will be gone until next spring. I am
hoping however to see you on my return. With best wishes.
Sincerely
Edgard Varèse


More:
http://preparedguitar.blogspot.com.br/2016/04/edgard-varese-idol-of-my-youth-by-frank.html

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2017 5:27 pm 
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^^^Pretty cool. Thanks MGG! Frank was so talented.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 4:39 am 
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Hi Mr GG, had you been at Julien's auction?
Just kidding, sorry, couldn't resist :wink:

Every Zappafan knows about the urge of teenage Zappa to meet his idol Varese. The more i am wondering, if he ever tried to make contact to his other big idol, Igor Stravinsky. I watched a docu on Stravinsky some time ago and found out that he lived the last years of his life in LA - so both were neighbours!

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:27 am 
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Was it the Post magazine? I understand no matching article could be found in Look (can't remember which biographer that was again...)

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 7:02 am 
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The Ondes Martenot, an obsolete 1928 electronic musical instrumet, which scarcity and rareness once prevented Zappa from producing some more obscure Varèse pieces, "the way he thought Varèse would do":
Thomas Bloch Ondes Martenot performance
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0aflcF0-ys


Also, file under Extraordinary Musical Instruments

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 10:43 am 
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ursinator wrote:
Hi Mr GG, had you been at Julien's auction?
Just kidding, sorry, couldn't resist :wink:

Every Zappafan knows about the urge of teenage Zappa to meet his idol Varese. The more i am wondering, if he ever tried to make contact to his other big idol, Igor Stravinsky. I watched a docu on Stravinsky some time ago and found out that he lived the last years of his life in LA - so both were neighbours!

Stravinsky was apparently pretty accessible too. It is known that Warren Zevon used to visit and study at his house when he was about 13 which would have been about 1960.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 12:57 pm 
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KUIII wrote:
Stravinsky was apparently pretty accessible too. It is known that Warren Zevon used to visit and study at his house when he was about 13 which would have been about 1960.

The more i am wondering that Zappa wasn't there. My personal guess was quite the opposite: that old Igor preferred to stay in isolation and only allowed a very few handchosen people to make contact to him.
There was lot of original footage in the docu i saw, especially from his time in america. One of his visitors was a very young Pierre Boulez. I browsed youtube a little bit and tried to find some of this footage again but didn't. At least i found out his adress when he moved there in the 1940s: 1260 North Wetherly Drive (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCtPUGVLZww ). I don't know if he moved to other places later. He left LA in 1969 and moved to New York where he died two years later. So there is a timewindow of a few years where both lived in LA.

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