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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 3:44 pm 
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Mr_Green_Genes wrote:
You can't say *SPAM* (=P-o-r-n) though, with is a shame for a Zappa site...


well, we all know the reason for that, don't we?
to block spammers who posted links to porn-sites, mikey put in a filter for the word porn...

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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 4:07 pm 
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Lumpy Gravy wrote:
Mr_Green_Genes wrote:
You can't say *SPAM* (=P-o-r-n) though, with is a shame for a Zappa site...


well, we all know the reason for that, don't we?
to block spammers who posted links to porn-sites, mikey put in a filter for the word porn...


yes, Obviously.


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 4:52 pm 
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The Black Page Part 2 wrote:
PetitWazoo72 wrote:
Glad to meet everyone and normally my posts will be 2-3 sentences max. And who is Schillmonger?


Schillmonger = Trendmonger. I coined the phrase as a result of his endless myopic posts in support of the ZFT, including their puzzling decision to put down all zappa related efforts not "approved" by them.

In short, he is a Schill for the ZFT.


with you. will keep that in mind moving forward....


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 4:58 pm 
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BillyDaMt wrote:
PetitWazoo72 wrote:
jaypfunk wrote:
it's ok to say "shit" here, really.


sounds good. thanks for the info above re: zappateers. you looking for anything in particular? would love to get grenoble somehow, maybe cleveland if you (or anyone) have either of those.


"And that's the way it goes sometimes, you just might find yourself in the clutches of a, Shithook..."


Which Tour you speaking of for Grenoble and Cleveland?


I should have clarified - '88...looking for a trade or b&p. Speaking of Cleveland I am listening to the 11.19.81 show right now. That late segment of the '81 tour was unbelieveable. Drowning Witch>>Baltimore of course, but everything sounded so good. That band grew miles in a matter of about 6 weeks. Frank can do that to you. I think we'll see the same from Dweez as this goes on.


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 6:10 pm 
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The guy was a tool, and will not be missed.


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 7:34 pm 
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If you want to pull in the girls just get Oprah Winfrey, Beyonce Knowels or Jennifer Lopez.

I wouldn't go see any of these if I was given a free flight to the USA, free tickets and a backstage pass, and unlimited access to Ed Nortons pant content. I'd rather lick a corpse.


Quote:
The problem is not with the musicians. As Jim Morrison once said Fragile Eggshell Minds. Don't expect any kids to come away after one ZPZ show or listening to a few Zappa CDs to comprehend all that much immediately. ZPZ is planting the seeds propelry for anyone who attends these shows of any age. But you have to go to these shows with an open mind instead of being fillled with some E-Coli digestive dissorder. Most of the kids who listen to music today are filled with shit on the brain. Give the kids some time. My god you've been listening to Zappa for how many years and I don't trust your judgement all that much.

With all due respect, Jim Morrison was honked up on goofballs (or whatever else he could get his clammy hands on) most of the time, so I really wouldn't pay him much attention. The youth of today are not as fragile as you think, and are a strong independant bunch, they will make their own decisions as to whether they think the ZPZ line up is good enough or not. It doesn't matter what anyone does or says, no-one can be coerced into liking a particular band or genre, no matter who is in the line up. You can't please everyone and for the hundreds of people who loved it there will always be some that didn't, for whatever reason
I'm under 35 and I have never had the opportunity to see Zappa live himself. Apart from seeing The Muffin Men a few years back, ZPZ was the first time I got to hear his music played live and I might add, played to such a high standard, imo, that I went away very, very happy.

Quote:
I am upset each time I see a kid who has no brain and never opens his mind.

I don't really know what you mean by this. I read it as you saying some kids don't like Zappa's music cos they don't open their mind enough to be able to appreciate it? Don't know if I got that right. If I did get that right and that's what you meant, then I think that's a really unfair comment to make. I hate the dirge that penetrates our lives and claims to be "music" nowadays as much as the next Zappa fan, but I wouldn't condemn anyone for liking something that wasn't to my taste. The very fact that we have this excuse for music in society nowadays, just makes what Dweezil is doing with these young "unknown" guys in the band, more important.

Quote:
Plain and simple they are not reaching their goal, these musicans are not professionals and their window is closing. If you want to help us improve thois lame ass experience, then please feel free. Your enereguyy would be much more useful in that area.

I have to say, the people complaining here that there is a lack of "professionalism" at the ZPZ gigs really need to get a grip. Why can't these musicians be appreciated for what they are? Talented individuals who have worked their arses off to learn the music of Zappa to the best of their ability, and pleased many, many hardcore Zappa fans in the process. These people playing with Dweezil, and the many more "unknown" musicians are the very people who will shape the future of the music we listen to. Without them continuing the excellent standard of performance that they provide, the rubbish around nowadays would be more prevalent than it is now! Personally, I'd rather have new blood in the band, and I think Pete, Scheila, Aarron and the rest of the guys do a stirling job. All credit to them.

Quote:
MAN, You are comparing ZPZ TO THE ORIGINAL MOTHERS???!!! WHAT THE F are you doing? People had a hard time understandingt the Mothers because Franlk was a genius, the band was amazing, and they were years ahead of their time. Do you really, actually, after playing with your little pals on this froum - relaly think that is the case with ZPZ????? NO = these kids fully iunderstand what they are doing, and secondly the ZPZ band is not even doing anything nearly as sophisticated. So why make the analogy. Geezus h man. No, these kids are pissed because they pay $85-100 and walk away saying what the f is this guy or that that guy doing oin stage? They see much better quite often for less money. Or - whay is that druimmer so fing lame? Or, why was that good guotar player onbly on stage for 30 minutes? Those are the questions we are trying to prevent, and them bringing out a move screen., and haviong the same musicians, will only make that experience worse, for the kids that do go back, and where are we in 3 years? You get it now big guy? Do you finally understand that when a 28 year old walsk away saying that hhe bass player eats ass compared to some f'ing jamband, then there is a seripus problem here? These young kids are way smarter than you give tjem credit fopr, they are not comapring ZPZ to a jamband. Tjhey are expecting different - and better , anfd they dont get it, and they get pissed off after sheelling out their cash. Get it now big guy? My arm is real tired from wiping so many of your's asses pver the last couple of days with this. I feel like I am dealimng witrh f'ing preschoolers half the time. Geezus h, comparing ZPZ to the mothers ort a jamband , and actually having the audacity to suggest that this si why these kids are so pissed off. Un f'ing believable man.

I don't think that's what anyone is intentionally trying to do here. Personally, i'd like to know which bass player "they" would like instead of Pete Griffin, or which keyboard player they'd like instead of Aarron Arntz....just curious. I'd like a frank (pardon the pun) discussion with someone who thought Pete Griffins bass playing was "eat ass" (assuming I have taken that term for its correct meaning).
You mentioned in one of your earlier posts that there were a lot of reviews made where people complained about the ZPZ gigs....could you direct me to some of them so I can have a read, it'd be appreciated, thanks.



Quote:
this is soimply about young kids NOT IMPRSSEd by the level of talent for the money they are paying. Period. Got it now?

Could any of these young kids you speak of (undoubtedly, some would be of the same or a similar age that the guys in the band are) get onto that stage and play nearly half as well as they do? What kind of talent have they asked for?

Quote:
So please offer some suggestions to imprve this average experience. (If you have none, then please keep quiet and spare us the nonsense.

This is a free forum for us all to share what we think. Please tolerate that. Thanks. 8)


Quote:
out of all the new wave za-paq gfans here whot hink they know something, you are by far the most f'd up.

You claimed that the youth are important, and their opinion counts in order for them to be Zappa fans, remain Zappa fans and continue to attend ZPZ gigs. Therefore, that direct insult, aimed at a "new wave zappa fan who thinks they know something", on the official Zappa forum isnt helping your cause really, is it?

Quote:
Here is the deal kid - some people though they were good, others thought they sucked ass hard. It is that simple.

People really don't need to be patronised, you must have said "some people though they were good, others thought they sucked ass hard" about 10 times now, though I have lost count. Just because people don't agree with your opinion, it doesn't mean they are wrong. :lol:

Quote:
These disappointed results have niothing to do with these kids not understanding what they DO! It has evrything to do woythhn the fact they are not good enought o impress enough kids to get into tjhe mnusic. There is too much competiton for the arrogance being showed. They need to play. They need professional musuicans oiut there. Is that so hard for you to grasp? geezus.

These people are professional musicians. If the "kids" aren't impressed with that, then maybe Zappa and the standard to which these people play, really isnt their bag at all. I don't recall Zappa ever trying to pull in the crowds. If people liked what he did, cool, if they didn't, he did it anyway.

Quote:
These are non [rofessional musicans who have never toured, whpo are bei g goiven a job to repseresnt some very hard music, and they are not sdoing the job. As a result the zppa family is losing out on a greta opportunity to mazimie 9interest and leverage that into a new audinece.
Can you please, finally, see the diofference? Dweez has a glorified bar band out there hcarging $75 a night, I am seeing thousands of negative rrvoiews, from bpeople who more than understand what they are doing, and we want them to do better. Please get current eith your comments and keep it in a true context.

As I recall, Dweezil specifically picked these people for the talent they had shown. He reiterated constantly, througout the tour that he wanted new blood involved and thats what he got, via the band, who did a great job under tremendous pressure, and via the parents who brought along their kids to see the show. He's a smart guy, he knows what he's doing, and knew Frank better than any one of us here.

Quote:
So when was your first Zappa show? How many times have you interviewed Frank to discuss what he was after like I have?

I am aware that this wasnt directed at me, but is that so relevant here in this conversation?

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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 7:49 pm 
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OK, so Im a total gonk for posting the above. I only read the first few pages and got so incensed, I posted my version of War and Peace before I realised the tool had been banned hahaha! Ahhh well. 8)

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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 8:38 pm 
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colauita68 wrote:
J.C.GreasyVII wrote:
Look Colaiuta68 why are you so high and mighty thinking you, Trendmonger, and your little secret society of FZ-appreciators in high places, should be the ones "helping" the ZFT get it right?! You never post on this forum, then you show up one day like your god's gift. Sounds like another Trendmonger to me. Listen to the words that Calvin spoke earlier in the thread. We've picked apart the ZFT's every move for the last 2-3 years. They've finally turned a corner in the right direction to making fans happy again. Don't come on this forum and start bashing DZ, the ZPZ core band, various distinguished forums, and whoever else, simply because you supposedly know what's right for the FZ-loving community. Do I give a fuck where you and your buddies work and how much clout you have? Fuck no. Nothing is wrong with the ZPZ band, they will continue to improve. DZ is doing the best he can. If kids are disappointed it's probably because they didn't really know the music anyway or really don't grasp what it's all about. 4-5000 new fans a night is all right with me. Christ, what you think Dweez is a miracle worker?



Who gives a fu-- about how many times I posted on this forum?? I forgot moree about Zappa than you ever knew, saw 15 shopws after the age of 27 (I dont count the ones when I was 10 like some people on this forum), I have interviewed aboyt 8 or 9 bandmemebers, I lived with one for a year, I still stay in touch with 2 or 3. I covered every tour he did from Beefheart through '88, 13 years on the road. And due to my present workload, I dont have time to hang out on this forum. So realize that this forum in no way represents the "experts", there are thousands and thousands out there who never even dial in. Because for every person like me, there are about 10 like my neighbor in jersey, who never, ever visits this forum, yet that guy knows more about Zappa than even I do. He saw every line up from the spring '69 MOI tour through '84, with the exception of the GW in '72. So please get over this bullsh-- about "regular" forum attendance. And how do you know this is not a new id for a very old user??? Dont be so f'ing stupid. And again, that is completely and utterly irreleveant. What is relevant is that I work in the industry, I directly represent about 750 people, I indirectly represent over 2 million. And you ashould care about that, if you cared about the audience growing as much as it could. And because of the fact I know FZ's material extremely well, am a long time supporter of the family financially, because we have a very long reach, and the fact many of those surveyed thought last year's tour bit dick, we are trying to create a list if ideas to help them out in '07. Yeah, they will get better - they have to. Question is how quickly and how many fans will they lose as a result. You seem to miss that whole concept . Believe me, they need the help, and they want the help. The power is in the numbers and the revenue they are not getting and the fan base they need to be reaching if they want the music to survive like the rest of us. So if you want to get involved and work with us then please offer suggestions. If you want to just feed people garbage like this then do it in private please. Thank you.


Dicksmack...what don't you get!? THEY DONT HAVE THE FUCKING MONEY TO GET EVERY PLAYER THEY WANT. THIS IS NOT FANTASY ROCKNROLL WHERE YOU PICK ALL THE PLAYERS REGARDLESS OF CIRCUMSTANCES
! Again with the"I went to a 100 Zappa shows", "I know more than you'll ever know about Zappa", Oh STFU. The music will survive regardless whether you save us all or not. Like so many have told you before: Zappa wasn't that popular when he was alive, why would he so much more in death. Normal day-to-day idiots don't get it. Do you really think the whole world will wake up and realize FZ's genius magically? Seriously stay the fuck off this forum, nobody wants hear your self-promoting bullshit. What makes you think if tou collect a bunch of ideas and brainstroms the ZFT will even listen to you? Answer: They won't, your opinion doesn't matter to them, and I don't want it to.

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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 10:48 pm 
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hj wrote:
...Pathetic ...


agreed, it's a fucking sad day when anyone gets banned...but maybe he's a happy guy now, on the day shift

the guy reminded me of a cross between the drool, clem & maybe a little white person on the side...see ya at the next zpz show mr. c-68




===========================================================================



...From what I've read on Arthur (I wish I could find the thread where somebody emailed him and asked him about it), he doesn't want anything to do with ZPZ...


Quote:
>from: 'arthur barrow' <bigear@**$#%&**.com>
>to: 'slime-o' <slime.o@¿£©¾®€¿.com>
>subject: re: dweezil's tour
>date: sat, 28 may 2005 22:25:39 -0700
>
>not likely
>
>ab
>
>----------
> >from: 'slime-o' <slime.o@¿£©¾®€¿.com>
> >to: 'arthur barrow' <bigear@**$#%&**.com>
> >subject: dweezil's tour
> >date: fri, may 27, 2005, 5:35 pm
> >
>
> > hi...just wondering, any chance of you hooking up with the dweez on his
> > zappa plays zappa tour?

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 2:04 am 
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I think we need to be careful to distinguish between being thrown off the forum and censorship. Yes, this is a "public" forum, but it only exists because a private enterprise (the ZFT) is funding it. As such, it is subject to their own discretion regarding behaviour vis a vis how it affects the forum at large. No, I'm not an apologist for the ZFT, but think of this analogy:

If you go to a resturant, it's a public space that's privately owned. In theory, everyone is welcome. Nobody can be denied access or service based on certain things like race or religious beliefs. However, if someone comes in and starts verbally abusing the customers or staff, the resturant has every right to throw that person out, for the sake of the people who are peacfully enjoying themselves, and thus the operation of the resturant itself.

I doubt that this guy was removed because he was critical of ZPZ. Correct me if I'm wrong (it's been a year now?), but Paul Green was VERY critical of the initial ZPZ shows, and I don't think he was banned, was he? This guy reminded me of a loud guy who goes into a bar and just makes everyone else pissed off/amused, but ultimately it's just annoying. In addition, it's pretty clear that he misrepresented himself, and was trying to manipulate others. Then he did it again and again, despite people asking him to stop.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 3:03 am 
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aspy_2nd_bunch wrote:
Quote:
If you want to pull in the girls just get Oprah Winfrey, Beyonce Knowels or Jennifer Lopez.

I wouldn't go see any of these if I was given a free flight to the USA, free tickets and a backstage pass, and unlimited access to Ed Nortons pant content. I'd rather lick a corpse.

[quote]

It's not that I am looking for Oprah Winfrey, Beyonce Knowels or Jennifer Lopez to be ZPZ Band Members or Icing On The Cake. This was just a perverted example using some 2007 Entetrtainment Media Icons that would immiddiately get 10,000 New fans in the seats fro every city.

The ZFTs goals and implimentation have always krept to Frank Zappa's artictic integrity. If one wants to literally analyze my comments of the feasability of Oprah Winfrey, Beyonce Knowels or Jennifer Lopez it would only seem to be artistically feasable for some One Shot Deal guest appearance to see what these folks could do in Frank Zappa's environment.

Frank had many guests over the years. I am sure back in the day when Zappa had Tom & Jerry aka Simon & Garfunkel make a guest appearance with the Mothers that those muscians at that time were not probable candidates for a guest spot. Same goes for Flo & Eddie and that turned out quite well. Anyhow it's not that I am pushing for this. It was more of a perverted analogy as to theat Faker68s wanting 10,000 new fans in some short window of opportunity.

To add a little to this there is a organization called Music For Youth
http://www.musicforyouth.org/that have done bennefit concerts with hundreds of artists performing the music of music icons such as Joni Mitchell, Bob Dylan & Bruce Springsteen to name a few. These concerts have been held at Carnegie Hall & Lincoln Center and they raise money for Youth Education in music. So at some point if the ZFT ever wants, and I repeat if, to get involved in something like that it could make for Franks music being performed by 25 artists over the last 4 decades.

I thnk the ZFT are handling the Artitic Integrity as best as anyone can in an environment where few in the industry have given a helping hand to FranK Zappa. It's just always been this way. In the last few years their plans are really moving the Projet/Object forward. In teh present mode this CDs/ DVDs releases, ZPZ 2006 & 2007 tours and Merchadizing deal are a few examples of the ZPZ upholding that artistic integrity.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 3:37 am 
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aspy_2nd_bunch wrote:
Quote:

Quote:
I am upset each time I see a kid who has no brain and never opens his mind.


Aspy writes:

I don't really know what you mean by this. I read it as you saying some kids don't like Zappa's music cos they don't open their mind enough to be able to appreciate it? Don't know if I got that right. If I did get that right and that's what you meant, then I think that's a really unfair comment to make. I hate the dirge that penetrates our lives and claims to be "music" nowadays as much as the next Zappa fan, but I wouldn't condemn anyone for liking something that wasn't to my taste. The very fact that we have this excuse for music in society nowadays, just makes what Dweezil is doing with these young "unknown" guys in the band, more important. [quote]

In any given period of time some will get it and some will not get it. Those that didn't get it were not meant to get it.

Now Kids today.

Well theses kids of today just have less of an open mind and false sense of expression than kids of the 1960s where the culture was encouraging people to think and express themselves quite a bit more individually. Not that the 60s is some perfect model for expressionism but I tend to think that generally speaking an open mind rebellion had started.

In 2007 kids express themselves by voting on American Idol, getting tattos and piercings moreso than using their eyes and ears or instruments and paint brushes or standign up to political flag waving.

In the 70s we really started seeing a downward spiral of expressionism with graffiti becoming some culture of expressionism. Hey blowing things up, abusing humans or someone's personal property have always ben to some extent a form of expressionism for kids that I do not support but it all tannsended into the music in Gangsta Rap. Much of the negative energy worldwide is severly misguided be it of humans of any age group.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 5:04 am 
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Trendmonger wrote:


It's not that I am looking for Oprah Winfrey, Beyonce Knowels or Jennifer Lopez to be ZPZ Band Members or Icing On The Cake. This was just a perverted example using some 2007 Entetrtainment Media Icons that would immiddiately get 10,000 New fans in the seats fro every city.

The ZFTs goals and implimentation have always krept to Frank Zappa's artictic integrity. If one wants to literally analyze my comments of the feasability of Oprah Winfrey, Beyonce Knowels or Jennifer Lopez it would only seem to be artistically feasable for some One Shot Deal guest appearance to see what these folks could do in Frank Zappa's environment.

Frank had many guests over the years. I am sure back in the day when Zappa had Tom & Jerry aka Simon & Garfunkel make a guest appearance with the Mothers that those muscians at that time were not probable candidates for a guest spot. Same goes for Flo & Eddie and that turned out quite well. Anyhow it's not that I am pushing for this. It was more of a perverted analogy as to theat Faker68s wanting 10,000 new fans in some short window of opportunity.

To add a little to this there is a organization called Music For Youth
http://www.musicforyouth.org/that have done bennefit concerts with hundreds of artists performing the music of music icons such as Joni Mitchell, Bob Dylan & Bruce Springsteen to name a few. These concerts have been held at Carnegie Hall & Lincoln Center and they raise money for Youth Education in music. So at some point if the ZFT ever wants, and I repeat if, to get involved in something like that it could make for Franks music being performed by 25 artists over the last 4 decades.

I thnk the ZFT are handling the Artitic Integrity as best as anyone can in an environment where few in the industry have given a helping hand to FranK Zappa. It's just always been this way. In the last few years their plans are really moving the Projet/Object forward. In teh present mode this CDs/ DVDs releases, ZPZ 2006 & 2007 tours and Merchadizing deal are a few examples of the ZPZ upholding that artistic integrity.


I know, I didnt for one minute think you were suggesting that list of materialistic morons be added to the line up! Frankly, i'd think anyone who suggested that was totally off their cake! I was just saying, in general, I'd rather lick a corpse than pay to see any of them, even if Ed Norton was included in the deal.

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 5:33 am 
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Trendmonger wrote:
BillyDaMt wrote:
feetlightup wrote:
BillyDaMt wrote:
The Black Page Part 2 wrote:
You know, I think Colauita68 is just Schillmonger posting as his alter ego. I mean the guy gave us all someone else to roast on these boards. Even made Schillmonger seem reasonable (relatively speaking of course) by comparison. hhhhm.

*cue X-files theme. The Truth is Out There[/u]


There is no way they are one and the same.
No fucking way.
Trendy is in his own fucking world.
Apples And Oranges.
And I honestly don't think Trendy could be unbiased.
Sorry, just don't see it happening.


It's still an interesting theory though - presenting an extreme anti-ZPZ opinion which unites the rest of us together in support of ZPZ? Think about it. We were all actually on Trend's side for once.


Bite your tongue, me in agreement with Trendy, never!
:wink:


Folks it's not the TRENDY side of FranK Zappa.

More and more and more...

Take a look at this Roxy/Overnight DVD that project is amazing.
I hope we can get one for Joe's Garage & Sheik Yerbouti. (er, shouldn't that be Apostrophe(')?)

...More....more...more

We can all agree or dissagree on any given issue and that is one thing that anyone with an open mind would agree upon. But fro anyone to say NEVER IN AGREEMENT. To not agree on any given issue just because of who is speaking is rediculous.

I had a boss one time if I said Black he said White.

This Boss did ask for... More...more...more....
And yet, some more...

People should come here and have an honest opinion regardless of any previous statement by any forum member regardless of historical commentary.


Douche, it was a joke.
lighten up, eh?
Why didn't you post the link to the Apostrophe/Over-nite Sensation thread where I agreed with you.... the winking pumpkin should have been your first clue Scooby.
:roll:

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 5:57 am 
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BillyDaMt wrote:
Trendmonger wrote:
BillyDaMt wrote:
feetlightup wrote:
BillyDaMt wrote:
The Black Page Part 2 wrote:
You know, I think Colauita68 is just Schillmonger posting as his alter ego. I mean the guy gave us all someone else to roast on these boards. Even made Schillmonger seem reasonable (relatively speaking of course) by comparison. hhhhm.

*cue X-files theme. The Truth is Out There[/u]


There is no way they are one and the same.
No fucking way.
Trendy is in his own fucking world.
Apples And Oranges.
And I honestly don't think Trendy could be unbiased.
Sorry, just don't see it happening.


It's still an interesting theory though - presenting an extreme anti-ZPZ opinion which unites the rest of us together in support of ZPZ? Think about it. We were all actually on Trend's side for once.


Bite your tongue, me in agreement with Trendy, never!
:wink:


Folks it's not the TRENDY side of FranK Zappa.

More and more and more...

Take a look at this Roxy/Overnight DVD that project is amazing.
I hope we can get one for Joe's Garage & Sheik Yerbouti. (er, shouldn't that be Apostrophe(')?)

...More....more...more

We can all agree or dissagree on any given issue and that is one thing that anyone with an open mind would agree upon. But fro anyone to say NEVER IN AGREEMENT. To not agree on any given issue just because of who is speaking is rediculous.

I had a boss one time if I said Black he said White.

This Boss did ask for... More...more...more....
And yet, some more...

People should come here and have an honest opinion regardless of any previous statement by any forum member regardless of historical commentary.


Douche, it was a joke.
lighten up, eh?
Why didn't you post the link to the Apostrophe/Over-nite Sensation thread where I agreed with you.... the winking pumpkin should have been your first clue Scooby.
:roll:


Well nice joke. Sorry I did not get it. It just seemed well, you would never agree with me on anything just because of who I am. I think I have observed some of that behavior from forum members on occasion. At times soem ahve just tuned me out or created arguments to my opinions because of who I am regardless of what I am saying or how many spelling errors. Why don't we for the sake of Franks Artistic Integrity burry the hatchet and enjoy Franks work in a kindler and gentler way. I am not suggesting a thousand points of light but rather just for us to agree what we agree on in an Official Sense making the most out of that.

If one of the reasons you think I am such a douche or kool aid drinker is because I get irate over forum members pushing Non-Official Concepts let me kindly remind you that this is an Official Website and all those Non-Official Sites have their own place to be Non-Official.

Personally maybe I will try to just not comment on anything that is not official and let everyone just say whatever they feel official or not.


Last edited by Trendmonger on Thu May 03, 2007 6:05 am, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 5:59 am 
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RatTomago wrote:
I think we need to be careful to distinguish between being thrown off the forum and censorship. Yes, this is a "public" forum, but it only exists because a private enterprise (the ZFT) is funding it. As such, it is subject to their own discretion regarding behaviour vis a vis how it affects the forum at large. No, I'm not an apologist for the ZFT, but think of this analogy:

If you go to a resturant, it's a public space that's privately owned. In theory, everyone is welcome. Nobody can be denied access or service based on certain things like race or religious beliefs. However, if someone comes in and starts verbally abusing the customers or staff, the resturant has every right to throw that person out, for the sake of the people who are peacfully enjoying themselves, and thus the operation of the resturant itself.

I doubt that this guy was removed because he was critical of ZPZ. Correct me if I'm wrong (it's been a year now?), but Paul Green was VERY critical of the initial ZPZ shows, and I don't think he was banned, was he? This guy reminded me of a loud guy who goes into a bar and just makes everyone else pissed off/amused, but ultimately it's just annoying. In addition, it's pretty clear that he misrepresented himself, and was trying to manipulate others. Then he did it again and again, despite people asking him to stop.


Perfectly put. If anyone doesn't think the ZFT can take a little heat they be crazy.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 6:24 am 
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Trendmonger wrote:
aspy_2nd_bunch wrote:
Quote:

Quote:
I am upset each time I see a kid who has no brain and never opens his mind.


Aspy writes:

I don't really know what you mean by this. I read it as you saying some kids don't like Zappa's music cos they don't open their mind enough to be able to appreciate it? Don't know if I got that right. If I did get that right and that's what you meant, then I think that's a really unfair comment to make. I hate the dirge that penetrates our lives and claims to be "music" nowadays as much as the next Zappa fan, but I wouldn't condemn anyone for liking something that wasn't to my taste. The very fact that we have this excuse for music in society nowadays, just makes what Dweezil is doing with these young "unknown" guys in the band, more important.

In any given period of time some will get it and some will not get it. Those that didn't get it were not meant to get it.

Exactly, not everyone will get it, so what's the point in trying to convert anyone? Those that get what Zappa is about, were always gonna be of that midset, those that don't get him, frankly I'd rather they were watching American Idol, to be honest.

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 6:41 am 
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aspy_2nd_bunch wrote:
Trendmonger wrote:
aspy_2nd_bunch wrote:
Quote:

Quote:
I am upset each time I see a kid who has no brain and never opens his mind.


Aspy writes:

I don't really know what you mean by this. I read it as you saying some kids don't like Zappa's music cos they don't open their mind enough to be able to appreciate it? Don't know if I got that right. If I did get that right and that's what you meant, then I think that's a really unfair comment to make. I hate the dirge that penetrates our lives and claims to be "music" nowadays as much as the next Zappa fan, but I wouldn't condemn anyone for liking something that wasn't to my taste. The very fact that we have this excuse for music in society nowadays, just makes what Dweezil is doing with these young "unknown" guys in the band, more important.

In any given period of time some will get it and some will not get it. Those that didn't get it were not meant to get it.


Exactly, not everyone will get it, so what's the point in trying to convert anyone? Those that get what Zappa is about, were always gonna be of that midset, those that don't get him, frankly I'd rather they were watching American Idol, to be honest.


I don't see Converting Everyone being a goal for the ZFT. I think it is a labor of love how they dedicate themselves to protecting the artistic integgrity of Frank Zappa and that includes ZPZ because that all falls under the ZFT Umbrella of Services being The Worlds Finest Optional Entertainment.

Regarding the youth of today. We can read in interviews and publications it is a goal of ZPZ where we can see getting Franks music performed Authentically & Authoritively, giving the youth an opportunity to open their minds to Frank's music is an objective. They are doing this.

My opinions of youth having less of an open mind on anything in 2007 as compared to 1967 is just my opinion. I don't see much of a Thought Rebellion against Goverment & Commercialism today. There is a downward spiral. I hope when Bush gets out of office this can change but it's really bad these days.

Possibly if a portion of youth open their mind to Frank that could develop that Freak Out Ideology but for kids today it is few and far between. I am glad the ZFT is giving them a chance for Zappa's Genious is a Category All To Itself. All of these Commercial Genres, with all their labeled record bins over the last 6 decades, in the general sense of Rock & Roll, has little to nothing at all to do with Frank Zappa and his ideas of a Thought Rebellion or much of youths individual or collective words and thoughts on society, artistic expression in general or understanding Zappa's music.

FranK Zappa and everything about him is Unique.

It's Zappa

This is not about force feeding Zappa like Castor Oil to a child. It's just about giving youth and hard cores a taste of Authentic And Authoritive.

No one else is doing this.

Faker68's bogus data collection and the ZFT being involved in this business practice seemed to be Malicious Slander.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 6:57 am 
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The way I see it is kids have always had the same mindset since the sixties. There will always be those that follow whats popular to try to fit in with their peer groups and those with a penchent for challenge. The thing about Zappa is he never was a truly mainstream musician and despite a couple of commercial successes, most Zappa fans IMHO are outside of the box trendwise. He was'nt pushing clothing styles, shoes, lifestyles, food products or anything else than simply the music. Thats what distinguishes Zappa from most pop icons is that it was always about music and artistic integrity.

Certainly the average Twizted or Jessica Simpson fan will likely never get Zappa's music and their not obligated too.

I like to think of Zappa fans as people who are fed up with conformity and want something more challenging to entertain themselves other than what the status quo has to offer, whether it was 40+ years ago or 40 years from now.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 7:11 am 
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Trendmonger wrote:
BillyDaMt wrote:
Trendmonger wrote:
BillyDaMt wrote:
feetlightup wrote:
BillyDaMt wrote:
The Black Page Part 2 wrote:
You know, I think Colauita68 is just Schillmonger posting as his alter ego. I mean the guy gave us all someone else to roast on these boards. Even made Schillmonger seem reasonable (relatively speaking of course) by comparison. hhhhm.

*cue X-files theme. The Truth is Out There[/u]


There is no way they are one and the same.
No fucking way.
Trendy is in his own fucking world.
Apples And Oranges.
And I honestly don't think Trendy could be unbiased.
Sorry, just don't see it happening.


It's still an interesting theory though - presenting an extreme anti-ZPZ opinion which unites the rest of us together in support of ZPZ? Think about it. We were all actually on Trend's side for once.


Bite your tongue, me in agreement with Trendy, never!
:wink:


Folks it's not the TRENDY side of FranK Zappa.

More and more and more...

Take a look at this Roxy/Overnight DVD that project is amazing.
I hope we can get one for Joe's Garage & Sheik Yerbouti. (er, shouldn't that be Apostrophe(')?)

...More....more...more

We can all agree or dissagree on any given issue and that is one thing that anyone with an open mind would agree upon. But fro anyone to say NEVER IN AGREEMENT. To not agree on any given issue just because of who is speaking is rediculous.

I had a boss one time if I said Black he said White.

This Boss did ask for... More...more...more....
And yet, some more...

People should come here and have an honest opinion regardless of any previous statement by any forum member regardless of historical commentary.


Douche, it was a joke.
lighten up, eh?
Why didn't you post the link to the Apostrophe/Over-nite Sensation thread where I agreed with you.... the winking pumpkin should have been your first clue Scooby.
:roll:


Well nice joke. Sorry I did not get it. It just seemed well, you would never agree with me on anything just because of who I am. I think I have observed some of that behavior from forum members on occasion. At times soem ahve just tuned me out or created arguments to my opinions because of who I am regardless of what I am saying or how many spelling errors. Why don't we for the sake of Franks Artistic Integrity burry the hatchet and enjoy Franks work in a kindler and gentler way. I am not suggesting a thousand points of light but rather just for us to agree what we agree on in an Official Sense making the most out of that.

If one of the reasons you think I am such a douche or kool aid drinker is because I get irate over forum members pushing Non-Official Concepts let me kindly remind you that this is an Official Website and all those Non-Official Sites have their own place to be Non-Official.

Personally maybe I will try to just not comment on anything that is not official and let everyone just say whatever they feel official or not.


Image
Oh, good grief

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 7:27 am 
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BillyDaMt wrote:


Image
Oh, good grief[/quote]

I like Charlie Brown. Have not seen it in years.

I ponder the thought of a Charlie Brown Halloween Special with Zappa Music.

Charlie Brown " The Devils Come Out"


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 7:31 am 
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BillyDaMt wrote:
Oh, good grief


HEY!! That's MY line!! :? :wink:

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 7:44 am 
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feetlightup wrote:
BillyDaMt wrote:
Oh, good grief


HEY!! That's MY line!! :? :wink:


Couldn't be helped.
It needed to be said. :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 7:46 am 
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BillyDaMt wrote:
feetlightup wrote:
BillyDaMt wrote:
Oh, good grief


HEY!! That's MY line!! :? :wink:


Couldn't be helped.
It needed to be said. :mrgreen:


Granted. Thanks for filling in for me. 8)

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 8:07 am 
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feetlightup wrote:
BillyDaMt wrote:
feetlightup wrote:
BillyDaMt wrote:
Oh, good grief


HEY!! That's MY line!! :? :wink:


Couldn't be helped.
It needed to be said. :mrgreen:


Granted. Thanks for filling in for me. 8)


Anytime.

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